amardeep.rishi
Par 100 posts (V.I.P)
Edited : Double Post
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Is the quota system for higher studies justified?
themaharana
Par 100 posts (V.I.P)
definately not. if this takes place, definately Arjun SIngh will have 2 take back the step. Arjun Singh, hope u listening to management paradise polls
rohit_pn
Rohit Nangia
Its absolutely correct to encourage backward classes to perform well and provide them withh all assistance in their endeavour to improve their standard of living.
But on the name of backward class upliftment, it is not correct to accept unqualified/poor quality people for higher education/jobs by reserving seats for them in competetive examinations/entries. These people should be given all assistance/guidance in achieving the minimum qualifing education and then shouls be asked to compete. If one is capable, he will get through and would be an asset to the organisation he joins. I feel that reservation is being used as political tool to get political advantage rather than upliftmentment of poors. What do you think?
But on the name of backward class upliftment, it is not correct to accept unqualified/poor quality people for higher education/jobs by reserving seats for them in competetive examinations/entries. These people should be given all assistance/guidance in achieving the minimum qualifing education and then shouls be asked to compete. If one is capable, he will get through and would be an asset to the organisation he joins. I feel that reservation is being used as political tool to get political advantage rather than upliftmentment of poors. What do you think?
shrijit_s
Par 100 posts (V.I.P)
It is more than 50 yrs of independence. We should have abolished all kinds of discrimination on d basis of caste, religion, race etc. But here the gr8 politicians go ahead & try to create more discrimination. So in effect we are discriminating against people to achieve equality.
Reservation goes against the basic premise of equality & the worst thing is that it inevitably fails. Lets consider the scenario when 50% students of an IIM/IIT is from a reserved category. There is no doubt that 5 to 10% of these will be those students, who are poor, who have put in a huge amount of effort & who deserve to be there. And these guys will even pass out from these institutes without much problem.
But a majority of these students will find it extremely difficult to cope with the course & in most probability will fail terribly. This is not just a baseless fact. I have observed this atleast in case of my college during BMS. They had got thru CCEE on the basis of reservation but found the course extremely difficult to cope up with & many of them flunked in the 1st year itself.
So for the 10% of these students, 40% meritorious students lose out on their seats.
Right now the single most objective of the govt should be to overhaul the primary education system, which is in a state of mess. A good percentage of SSC passouts don't even know to write their own name. Absenteeism of the teachers in the villages is huge, because they are not accountable to anyone. If such is the scenario how will a student, who studies in such school ever dream of getting into an IIM. Under reservation also his seat will be taken up by the so called 'Creamy Layer', who have the education backing but they do not deserve this.
Politicians also say that reservation in education, jobs will lead to decrease in discrimination. How can they ensure this?? Discrimination, if it exists, can still continue unabated. No kind of reservation can stop this.
I am also concerned about the effect of reservation on the social attitude of people. Already protests have started by groups who are pro reservation & those who are against reservation. This can always explode into a more serious form of protest, which I hope will never happen.
I just pray that the PM will give this a serious thought before taking any action.
Cheers
Reservation goes against the basic premise of equality & the worst thing is that it inevitably fails. Lets consider the scenario when 50% students of an IIM/IIT is from a reserved category. There is no doubt that 5 to 10% of these will be those students, who are poor, who have put in a huge amount of effort & who deserve to be there. And these guys will even pass out from these institutes without much problem.
But a majority of these students will find it extremely difficult to cope with the course & in most probability will fail terribly. This is not just a baseless fact. I have observed this atleast in case of my college during BMS. They had got thru CCEE on the basis of reservation but found the course extremely difficult to cope up with & many of them flunked in the 1st year itself.
So for the 10% of these students, 40% meritorious students lose out on their seats.
Right now the single most objective of the govt should be to overhaul the primary education system, which is in a state of mess. A good percentage of SSC passouts don't even know to write their own name. Absenteeism of the teachers in the villages is huge, because they are not accountable to anyone. If such is the scenario how will a student, who studies in such school ever dream of getting into an IIM. Under reservation also his seat will be taken up by the so called 'Creamy Layer', who have the education backing but they do not deserve this.
Politicians also say that reservation in education, jobs will lead to decrease in discrimination. How can they ensure this?? Discrimination, if it exists, can still continue unabated. No kind of reservation can stop this.
I am also concerned about the effect of reservation on the social attitude of people. Already protests have started by groups who are pro reservation & those who are against reservation. This can always explode into a more serious form of protest, which I hope will never happen.
I just pray that the PM will give this a serious thought before taking any action.
Cheers
amardeep.rishi
Par 100 posts (V.I.P)
well quota system is going to be a futile...employement of backward class is a social issue not legal one....govt should understand the consequences of it.
amardeep.rishi
Par 100 posts (V.I.P)
Hye Karma.....
i think this reservation thing is loosing it;s ground now....as in yeasterday newspaper says knowledge panel headed by sam pitroda voted out this fundamental of reservation.They opposed the plan of addmissions in IIM's or IIT's through reservation as it's imp to maintain the healthy spirit of compition in order to improve the standred of system.
None can gainsay the fact that this reservation voice leaked to gain political benefits....but time is surely changing buddy.
i think this reservation thing is loosing it;s ground now....as in yeasterday newspaper says knowledge panel headed by sam pitroda voted out this fundamental of reservation.They opposed the plan of addmissions in IIM's or IIT's through reservation as it's imp to maintain the healthy spirit of compition in order to improve the standred of system.
None can gainsay the fact that this reservation voice leaked to gain political benefits....but time is surely changing buddy.
shrijit_s
Par 100 posts (V.I.P)
amardeep.rishi said:
amardeep..the Knowledge committe is just one committe set up by the govt..Its recommendations is well just a recommendation...the govt has the final right on its acceptance...
Though I hope I am proved wrong..but I think that 50% reservations is soon going to be a reality
looking at the fact that there is minimal political opposition to reservations per se...Cheers!!
Baah... who cares abt political opposition..
If it comes to it.. Management Students can revolt and all politicians would have to succumb because if all management students unite and decide to vote in favour of the party revolting against the quota system ... the parties supporting the quota system will find themselves sitting on a gas..
If it comes to it.. Management Students can revolt and all politicians would have to succumb because if all management students unite and decide to vote in favour of the party revolting against the quota system ... the parties supporting the quota system will find themselves sitting on a gas..
amardeep.rishi
Par 100 posts (V.I.P)
well karkit u sounds reallly furious....rightly so...
let me tell u shriijit this is how things begins..atleast some knowledge group is there to advice the govt...and we are fortunate this at this point of time we are having one of the best people leading(PM and President)...as everyone says politics is a dirty game but people r raising their voice and govt is now pondering the long term effect of this issue...Some of our smart politicians r still in the vicious cycle of votes, business fraternity is also taking some hard steps by opposing this law of insanity...rightly said by Karkit even student class and educatd youth is standing tall against this act.y to loose hope afterall it's us who will be responsible for concequences...we r the one who will decide the future...lets not loose hope...and don't accept the things so easily.
Let me quote u a line by Larry ellison(CEO, Oracle)..."The most important aspect of my personality, as far as determining my success goes, has been my questioning conventional wisdom, doubting the experts, and questioning authority"
We should have the courage to speak what v think...so don't accept the things so easily u think incorrect!!
let me tell u shriijit this is how things begins..atleast some knowledge group is there to advice the govt...and we are fortunate this at this point of time we are having one of the best people leading(PM and President)...as everyone says politics is a dirty game but people r raising their voice and govt is now pondering the long term effect of this issue...Some of our smart politicians r still in the vicious cycle of votes, business fraternity is also taking some hard steps by opposing this law of insanity...rightly said by Karkit even student class and educatd youth is standing tall against this act.y to loose hope afterall it's us who will be responsible for concequences...we r the one who will decide the future...lets not loose hope...and don't accept the things so easily.
Let me quote u a line by Larry ellison(CEO, Oracle)..."The most important aspect of my personality, as far as determining my success goes, has been my questioning conventional wisdom, doubting the experts, and questioning authority"
We should have the courage to speak what v think...so don't accept the things so easily u think incorrect!!
Well lots have been discussing here about quotas since 50%is already decided as we cant do anything now i would liike to ask one question to Arjun singh rite now whom will he prefer to give admission:
1]to a quota person who is a son of a millionare or
2]to a poor person who has gr8 IQ with gud marks but lost it only becoz less seats in open category.
Considering SC,STs it can be taken into consideration that they were treated really bad at that time may be more worse than the animals but for OBCs they were never as in treated bad nor any injustice have been done to them
Please give in ur feedbacks for this
1]to a quota person who is a son of a millionare or
2]to a poor person who has gr8 IQ with gud marks but lost it only becoz less seats in open category.
Considering SC,STs it can be taken into consideration that they were treated really bad at that time may be more worse than the animals but for OBCs they were never as in treated bad nor any injustice have been done to them
Please give in ur feedbacks for this
I completely agree with u.Well its just tht brains should be working.CUT OFFS should be same for evryone.For sometime leave aside the money part i mean definitely they have reduction in fees but cutoffs should be same for everyone coz all of them try hard to get in.So y quotas for that?SNEHALT said:
amardeep.rishi
Par 100 posts (V.I.P)
Ananta valid point raised.....but there could b n number of questions one can frame on this regard from arjun singh or whosoever advocate reservation...fact is this is a social issue not a legal one..it's can't be a law...and there r lots of things needs consideration....like they want quota on jobs too...ananta said:
-will it b only at entry level or at all levels?
-according to new legislation it will be mandatory for companies to declare their total employment.(will it be possible for small scale industries as their profits r depleting..eg.small computer business,jwellery or dairy business)
-industries would scream that it affects their competitiveness
-if the law is extended to foreign companies it will breach TRIMS agreement in the WTO which prohibits local content requirements on foreign firms.
-till how long this is going to stay...how many generations will take benefit from it...or how long they will remain unprivilaged?
basic question is...will it b fine to sideline the quality or merit just to promote reservation as they think it's the only way to help unpirivilage.It's been 60 years reservation is prevelant in our system and it never raised the standered yet..probably it's the time to rethink on this paradigm.it's not working!!
asnwer is to provide them financial aids for better primary education and raising their standerd to match up with normal...special traning institutes should open and better loan facilities could b provided.
else open a new IIM's next to IIM(BLACKI) and named (IIM OBC)only OBC will study and only OBC will teach.no harm in giving quota's to SC/ST's...:big_grin:
gaurav200x
Gaurav Mittal
One simple analysis will reveal many facts... Let's look it from the mid 20th century... The so called dalits/elites of now, were treated like untouchables and they were not allowed to join the schools and colleges for the upper class, irrespective of their intellectual power. Hence, at the time, to improve their status, quota system was introduced.. However, if u look around, the std . of living of the citizens has improved drastically... I don't deny that poverty isn't there, yet the citizens have better living std as compared to the past.. They get a lot of subsidies on the basic commodities, the cost of which is borne, by the middle and the upper class, in the form of tax... Alright, so far, so good!
However, despite this improvement, the quota system is still present. The govt. hasn't done much on the primary education and on the contrary, it is making reservations on the secondary edu.
How can u expect a firm building...when its foundation is weak??
u want to improve the living stds further, strengthen their base, i.e. primary education. The only ppl benefitting from the quota would be the rich in the elites as the poor would still have to think about the cost of education. I have studied with many guys belonging to SC/ST and they went to IIT, instead of me, bcoz of their reservation. What's more even the people having a lower score, were inducted... Why this partiality? I know i have better brains than them and their living standard is the same as mine?
Hence, it is very clear that the quota system introduced is meaningless and merely a vote-gathering gimmick.
Quota would be hunky dory at the lower levels and the govt needs to provide basic amenities which should support them in the competition and not snatch it and give it entirely to them... such that there would be no competition at all..
However, despite this improvement, the quota system is still present. The govt. hasn't done much on the primary education and on the contrary, it is making reservations on the secondary edu.
How can u expect a firm building...when its foundation is weak??
u want to improve the living stds further, strengthen their base, i.e. primary education. The only ppl benefitting from the quota would be the rich in the elites as the poor would still have to think about the cost of education. I have studied with many guys belonging to SC/ST and they went to IIT, instead of me, bcoz of their reservation. What's more even the people having a lower score, were inducted... Why this partiality? I know i have better brains than them and their living standard is the same as mine?
Hence, it is very clear that the quota system introduced is meaningless and merely a vote-gathering gimmick.
Quota would be hunky dory at the lower levels and the govt needs to provide basic amenities which should support them in the competition and not snatch it and give it entirely to them... such that there would be no competition at all..
karma
Rochit Jain
kartik said:
well heres a person a with a change of heart...... atlast kartik ur on our side.... i just am aghast at seeing these young students who are goin to do their mbbs and other courses at IITs, IIMs being beaten up by police. well now i am sure the police have no heart. this gave me deja vu feeling... like from rang de basanti.. like opposing injustice and then u only get killed or beaten up:SugarwareZ-158::SugarwareZ-158:
gaurav200x
Gaurav Mittal
yaar.. what can th police do? they have to follow the orders they get from their baap (i.e. Arjun Singh) and besides they have to ensure proper law and order situation or else this mob would enter into vandalism....karma said:
However, every revolution has to face some brunt of opposition, violence but it is incredible how they are revolting against corrupt politics...
Three cheers for them!!!!!!!!!!! :thumb:
amardeep.rishi
Par 100 posts (V.I.P)
well...nice to c that kartik is now supporting us...
karma
Rochit Jain
mob couldnt have entered into vandalism it was mentioned they wer on silent protest, and the police just lathichrged them even not sparing girls.... even a person who may be a senior politician or police officer if had spoken to them they would have understood.. but nuthing of tht sorts happened.... well tht crowd was a sophisticated educated mob not the violent agitators type.. but kudos for their efforts....
karma
Rochit Jain
a tI think we should have job reservations in all the fields. I
completely support the PM and all the politicians for promoting this.
Let's start the
reservation with our cricket team. We should have 10 percent
reservation for muslims. 30 percent for OBC, SC/ST like that. Cricket
rules should be modified accordingly. The boundary circle should be
reduced for an SC/ST player. The four hit by an OBC player should be
considered as a six and a six hit by a OBC player should be counted
as 8 runs. An OBC player scoring 60 runs should be declared as a
century.
We should influence ICC and make rules so that the pace bowlers like
Shoaib Akhtar should not bowl fast balls to our OBC player. Bowlers
should bowl maximum speed of 80 kilometer per hour to an OBC player.
Any delivery above
this speed should be made illegal.
Also we should have reservation in Olympics. In the 100 meters race,
an OBC player should be given a gold medal if he runs 80 meters.
There can be reservation in Government jobs also. Let's recruit SC/ST
and OBC pilots for aircrafts which are carrying the ministers and
politicians (that can really help the country.. )
Ensure that only SC/ST and OBC doctors do the operations for the
ministers and other politicians. (Another way of saving the country..)
Let's be creative and think of ways and means to guide INDIA
forward...
Let's show the world that INDIA is a GREAT country. Let's be proud of
being
an INDIAN..
So, what do you think, huh???
HEY lets fight together and I assure that v can chuck the
reservations . I need your support desparetely . I have a fll plan to
oppose it so plz join hands with me fight this evil. I need youll .
Thanks friends.
Please call me and ill tell you the date for a meeting. V will be
having a meet wherein students of all fraternities will get united.
Even the press will be there!!
give me your support and we will lead a protest, help and support the revolution. join hands reply to me for your support. or use this thread to express your support.
completely support the PM and all the politicians for promoting this.
Let's start the
reservation with our cricket team. We should have 10 percent
reservation for muslims. 30 percent for OBC, SC/ST like that. Cricket
rules should be modified accordingly. The boundary circle should be
reduced for an SC/ST player. The four hit by an OBC player should be
considered as a six and a six hit by a OBC player should be counted
as 8 runs. An OBC player scoring 60 runs should be declared as a
century.
We should influence ICC and make rules so that the pace bowlers like
Shoaib Akhtar should not bowl fast balls to our OBC player. Bowlers
should bowl maximum speed of 80 kilometer per hour to an OBC player.
Any delivery above
this speed should be made illegal.
Also we should have reservation in Olympics. In the 100 meters race,
an OBC player should be given a gold medal if he runs 80 meters.
There can be reservation in Government jobs also. Let's recruit SC/ST
and OBC pilots for aircrafts which are carrying the ministers and
politicians (that can really help the country.. )
Ensure that only SC/ST and OBC doctors do the operations for the
ministers and other politicians. (Another way of saving the country..)
Let's be creative and think of ways and means to guide INDIA
forward...
Let's show the world that INDIA is a GREAT country. Let's be proud of
being
an INDIAN..
So, what do you think, huh???
HEY lets fight together and I assure that v can chuck the
reservations . I need your support desparetely . I have a fll plan to
oppose it so plz join hands with me fight this evil. I need youll .
Thanks friends.
Please call me and ill tell you the date for a meeting. V will be
having a meet wherein students of all fraternities will get united.
Even the press will be there!!
give me your support and we will lead a protest, help and support the revolution. join hands reply to me for your support. or use this thread to express your support.
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